Artist
 |
After the song is structured and recorded what are the next steps to producing a final product? I've been having the devil of a time and am confused that I am unable to make my ideas sound like they should. My songs sound muddy, too shrill here, vocals somewhere, and practically no dynamics. Geez...
Could someone lay down their recording steps as a template or basic standard that is used so I could have some sort of foundation to guide my future recordings and improve the quality of my posted music? I feel like I'm running in circles without making the progress I'd like because I frankly don't know where to start. What do you guys do? Your music is so professionally done and sounds beautiful. I feel like I'm wasting my time and maybe I'm just not cut out to produce music. I do feel like I should be smart enough to learn, though.
Signed, Depressed
 |
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 11:04 am |
|
|
Artist
 |
maybe you should tell us a bit about your setup....
we discussed this recently and I know how difficult it is to get the stuff down like you hear it in your head... Took me years and years....
so knowing what you use for recording might help a bit.
KC |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 11:24 am |
|
|
Artist
|
For this last song I used drum loops and recorded directly into Garageband'09 - guitars/bass into Presonus Audiobox USB to Macbook and vocals Shure57 into Presonus Aud. USB into Macbook. I used duplicate rhythm tracks panned left and right, lead throughout track, mid 8 lead track and fuzz guitar track plus bass and vocals. I tried to eq each track one at a time and felt I had good sound. Then I made sure no levels were peaking. I started with the drums, added bass, the rhythm, then leads, and then vocals each time I added a track I checked the sound. It still doesn't sound quite right. For bass I used AUhipass set at 106 hz/0 bd to try and cut some mud on the bass. I redid the whole process from scratch 3 times flattening out the 31 band EQ and re-doing it. I don't know if this info helps or not, but I grateful for suggestions. |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 11:56 am |
|
|
Artist
|
Maybe I'm adding to much stuff, but in my head it should be there. In my redo's I also stripped down my individual trax of effects and EQ, too so I could refresh and start anew. Maybe it's only in my final EQ set up....I do feel like I learned some things here, yet the growing pains and learning curve seems quite steep for me. |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 11:59 am |
|
|
Artist
 |
@BigJimSlade - I'm listening to bunch of your other tunes so I can get a reference point and give some feedback. Here's some of my thoughts, and before I begin just remember that I think your stuff sounds fine, it's very appropriate for the genre of music as far as I can tell.
1) Be careful with plugins and effects. Just because you have them doesn't mean you need to use 'em. EQ should usually be used subtractively, and compressors/limiters are used to mess with the dynamics.
2)Simplify. Keep things simple and rhythmically solid. Focus on the music part sounding the way you like it before you add any effects. Basically, make it sound good with NOTHING except the playing. I mean, would you rather hear something that's pristine and edited to hell on a protools system played by a bunch of Disney hires, or a COOKING R&B band recorded on an iPhone in their garage? I'll take the cooking R&B band on the iphone in their garage any day, because it's rehearsed and everyone's playing well, and *** is real.
3)Guitars on your tracks; I notice, are very trebly and quite bassy; perhaps it's not a problem with the bass and kick, but rather a problem of guitar tones stealing other instrument's frequencies? Are you using plugins or a miced amp? I'd recommend maybe starting with a flatter tone on your guitar amp, more mids and less highs. Don't be afraid to turn it waaaaay down, or even off just to see where your starting point is. Just because you have these dials and controls on your amps and fx doesn't mean they have to be cranked up too far. When I use Logic amp sims 9I try not to, I prefer real amps...), I tend to turn the bass to about 10%, mids at about 20% and trebs at about10%. I don't usually feel the need to eq anything after I get 'the' sound and I get very upset with people that record me that start messing with EQ and comp on some of my guitar tracks. Most things can be fixed by getting a good sound off the bat, and just manipulating volume and panning.
4)So like I said, get rid of the junk. Rehearse a lot, and don't be afraid to get out a metronome and get the timing of stuff perfect. Watch your pick attack on stringed instruments, how hard you hit on drums, and get a pop filter for your vocal microphone (Cheap, you can probably make one...) The more you rehearse your stuff, the better your recording will be. Trust me, I've released a lot of dogshit in my time hahahah.
5)The bass sounds like it's slightly overdriving and clipping on almost all of your tracks that bass is there. I assume you're going in direct? Watch your attack, and how you play and that will have a HUGE impact on your overall mix. A preamp or a DI will help, hell a Line6 Pod will help things out drastically. Bass is a different animal, and it can be tough to record. Make sure that when you record, you do bass and drums first.
6)Not every instrument will be in your face. Some of them are there to support the other tracks. I like to think of vocals being most prominent, then rhythm guitars, with bass and drums on an equal footing volume-wise. Want to learn how to track drums and bass? go listen to some stuff where bass and drums is super prominent. Rush, for instance... Primus, Led Zeppelin, the Who all provide excellent reference as far as mixing. For overall mixing excellence, check out ANYTHING with Mutt Lange's name on it. Def Leppard, AC/DC, Shania Twain..
7)Playing with loops is cool and all, but I find that it's kind of a pain to get loops to sound 'right' with my other tracks. They are a huge timesaver, and I have them at my disposal, but I'd rather just play drums in on a real kit, or sequence them with a toontrack plugin like DFH or EZ Drummer. I have a big library of drum loops, but I always prefer to sequence them myself, or play them. (Betamonkey has a good library, I have them all, but I don't really use them...)
Okay, I hope some of this helps, man. good luck, and don't forget that you already sound fine so keep your confidence up and keep doing what you do. Have a good one, man!
http://www.guitarius.net
http://www.Youtube.com/Scottulus |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 1:10 pm |
|
|
Artist
 |
First I have to say that I mostly work with pure midi tracks and not recorded audio. But I get pretty good dynamic sound without using much EQ. I doubt EQ is your main problem.
I can see that you are aware that in the digital domain clipping is a no-no and as far as I could hear on your tracks you main problem is that your music is compressed down to no dynamic range.
Let us start at the source. Make sure each track is recorded
- without clipping in the sound interface. Better a little to low than any clipping.
- be careful with compression. Use little or none at all when recording. It is easier to control when you compress the sound in the DAW software.
Once recorded in the DAW
- be careful with the compression used. A little compression enhances the details and enhances the perceived volume. Too much and the sound collapses and sounds flat and lifeless. Use compression with care.
- if the track contains extreme transients, you can put a limiter in addition to the compressor. In Logic that I use the compressor also has a limiter you can turn on. When used right the limiter cannot really be heard. It just cuts away crazy transients.
- if the recorded track has huge volume in the extreme low bass, EQ this away with a steep high pass filter, typically around 40-50 Hz. Do this EQ before passing the signal to effects plugins.
- If you use EQ use it in small amounts. Cut steep on the extreme low or extreme high if you need to but in the range from 50 Hz to 10 kHz only use minor values. Few dB. And be more careful when boosting than with cutting. EQ can mess up more than it helps. It is best to get the original sound right.
- Do not think that each track needs to be set to near max volume. If your music consists of multiple tracks (not just a solo piano for example), then it is the sum of all the tracks that should add up to just below the 0 dB point. Expect each track in a typical 5-15 track song to be working between -10 and -20 dB.
- When the whole thing is mixed fine expect the output master track to have a volume around -6 dB. Do not decrease the master track volume. Keep it at 0 dB. Move all the individual track volumes until it sums up around -6 dB. There can be a little peak here and there close to 0 but keep the general peak around -6 when it is all summed up.
- when all is well balanced, and sounds dynamic, finally add a little compression or adaptive limiting to the master track. I always use Logic Pros adaptive limiter with a gain of 3 dB and the max limit set to -0.1. That gives a nice volume boost without destroying dynamic provided.
I hope this helps |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 1:13 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
@GuitariusMaximus: I think the "keep it simple, stupid" philosophy is where I may need to begin and I appreciate your input and suggestions. I'll have to re-read them several times.
Production confidence - low, drive to learn - high, ability to put suggestions into play - lots of time. Thanks, man!
@KennethLavrsen: quality information and I thank you for it. The compression suggestion strikes me as I probably abuse this way too much. |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 1:48 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
this post deleted |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 1:53 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
@BigJimSlade Trial and error, man. Just keep trying stuff and over time you'll get a better idea of what works for you. Some of the biggest troubles I have is when i introduce a new piece of gear and all of a sudden it's fidelity is so much superior to what else I have that it makes it tough to integrate.
Make sure you keep having fun, and remember that at the end of the day, the average listener doesn't care about how much EQ or comp, or what preamps you used, they just want a cool song. Good luck, man! |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 2:30 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
@GuitariusMaximus: I sincerely appreciate your motivating and positive vibes, Chief! I know it's going to take time, like you say, but when you get a tune you just want to rush it out and I need to be more patient with the whole process. Thanks again! |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 2:37 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
Once you find the right EQ and compression settings for your guitar and vocal it all becomes second nature. You just need to get from the sucky sound level to pretty good and then it will be the music that takes your focus. It is worth the few days of investment to get the basics right. |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 4:42 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
@KennethLavrsen: thanks, also, for your ideas. I think maybe a break and reading about this stuff may be in order. I've got to get better at this, but also so that the final process doesn't take such a significant time drain. It must be "worth it". And, a quality product made shouldn't be the headache, incredible time munching and so-so results this last project gave me.
Thanks, KL |
|
|
|
Aug 19, 2012 | 7:42 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
Sometimes, it can be the music itself that is just mehhh. Try a different key, or changing the tempo, things like that.
Also, don't be afraid to layer your instruments, some rhythm guitar tracks I do get, like 8 tracks or more, bass I've done up to 4, and drums, well they get ugly in a quick hurry... hahaha Anyways, hope any of this helps, man! |
|
|
|
Aug 22, 2012 | 12:15 am |
|
|
Artist
|
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=ZQ7z_bqci5E
@BigJimSlade Check out this video, it's pretty good in regards to subtractive EQing... |
|
|
|
Aug 22, 2012 | 7:18 pm |
|
|
Artist
|
@GuitariusMaximus: thanks, that is an interesting and informative vid. |
|
|
|
Aug 23, 2012 | 9:57 am |
|
|
|
Join Now
Login
